Hi, all!
We are in the market for a C36 and have found a '96 MkII for sale by owner in the Seattle area that is really set up for cruising. The only problem is that she spent 5-6 years down in Mexico, so she's really showing signs of being closed up in the tropics (about 70% of the interior finish need to be redone, the "bronze" light fixtures are all pretty corroded, etc)...
Of more concern to me is that the main forward bulkhead has water damage along the base. And, according to the owner (and past owner) this was the result of a leaking supply line to the toilet and failed sump in the shower that allowed the pan in the head to overflow and just "sit" against the back of the bulkhead for... (god knows how long...)
What are your thoughts on this? I realize it is tough to tell just by looking at the pics. What would the repair process look like? Or, do you just lightly sand and refinish and act like nothing happened?
Thanks!
- Steve
(soon to be C36 owner, former Hans Christian 34, C&C 40, and C30 owner...)
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B


[I]"Would You Buy This Boat?"[/I]
I wouldn’t rule it out based on what I see here but there are other factors to consider. The main one is price. I wouldn’t pay “top dollar” for a boat in any condition in this market.
I’m no surveyor but as far as bulkhead damage goes, I’d probe the area with an ice pick or something similar. I wouldn’t want to see any appreciable penetration with, say, a flat bladed screwdriver. More penetration = more concern. I’d also pull out a few of those screws and look for obvious signs of rot. If you can take a dental pick and easily remove rotted wood out of the hole, I be suspicious. I recall others have posted photo & comments on bulkhead replacement. I believe the did the work themselves. Do a search for it.
Where the lamps are concerned, I bought near replacements to the originals here: [url]http://www.reddenmarine.com/marine-supplies.cfm/lights-cabin/sea-dog-cor...
Good luck.
Marc & Susan Garcia
"Solla Sollew" #1473, Mk.II
San Buenaventura, Ca.
I agree that some investigation is necessary to determine if the moisture damage is merely cosmetic or if surgery is required.
The C36IA has an article in the Technical - Maintenance library written by an owner who did a replacement of that bulkhead. The article is well written and photo documented, so it would be a good guide should you need to replace the bulkhead. The Technical Upgrade and Maintenance libraries are not open to the public; they require paid Membership (capital M) in the C36IA to access.
The rough interior you see may be an opportunity waiting to be leapt on. It may mean money in your pocket. A complete strip and re-stain of the interior seems in order. But man, it will be beautiful when it's all done.
Larry Brandt
S/V High Flight #2109
Pacific Northwest, PDX-based
2002 C-36 mkII SR/FK M35B
Solla - I probed around a little bit with a screwdriver, and it didn't have the "hollow" feel that seems to happen with laminated plywoods, etc...
The lights are the ceiling lights - the dual swivel type that fit into the molded areas in the ceiling. (see attached). I noticed that Catalina Direct can no longer get the originals or refits, so if anyone knows where to get these (or something that logically works/fits there), let me know...
Larry - thanks for the note on the tech article. I am a member, so I'll give it a look.
In terms of stripping at re-staining - I've never done "touch-ups" before, trying to match/feather existing areas, etc... Is this possible? Or would it be better to just strip the whole bulkhead? (seems like a heck of a lot of work...)
Cheers!
- Steve
__________________
Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
I have the same overhead chromed light fixtures and they were showing pitting and overall corrosion, so I took them off and used a Dremel-powered buffing wheel and they shined up very nicely. I put a good coat of wax on to retard further corrosion and they are holding up reasonably well.
As for the bell-shaped cabin lights, I took the approach of a friend who used a wire wheel on a Dremel and then painted them with a faux brass paint. They have a different look than shiny new brass, but they don't look bad and it saved a lot of money replacing them.
Call me a heretic, but I don't want the constant hassle and expense keeping my boat looking showroom new; I just want her seaworthy and looking 'pretty darn good.'
Duane Ising - Past Commodore (2011-2012)
s/v Diva Di
1999 Catalina 36 Hull #1777
Std rig; wing keel, M35B, Delta (45#)
Punta Gorda, FL
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/diva-di/
[QUOTE=deising;10614]
Call me a heretic, but I don't want the constant hassle and expense keeping my boat looking showroom new; I just want her seaworthy and looking 'pretty darn good.'[/QUOTE]
Amen to that...!!!!:)
Gary and Cathy Price
1997 C36 Mk II Tall Rig/Wing Keel Imagine...
Hull # 1617
Worton Creek, Md.
Northern Chesapeake Bay
Thanks for the insight on the bulkhead, folks. I went ahead and discussed it with the current owner (who just wants "out" of the boat) and was able to come to a reasonable agreement on price. So - she should be ours very soon!
Now, off to figure out some ways to get more ventilation through the boat (without covering the much-needed daylight hatches with nicro vents...) I love the look of the mkII, but I miss my '86 mk1 with the dorades, etc...
I'll be posting pics/updates of a number of upgrades as we go (adding webasto heat, a new dodger/enclosure, etc...)
Cheers!
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
Steve, welcome to the clan.
Actually, rather than posting your project photos here in the Forums, it would help everyone if you'd write an article for us, then send it to us as a Word file, and with high resolution jpegs emailed separately. Then we'll package that all together for JibSheet, Mainsheet, the C36IA Technical Library, or some combination of these as we need. Mk II stuff can be sent to me; Mk I stuff to Steve Frost. Our email addresses are in the Officers folder off the C36IA Home Page.
Larry Brandt
S/V High Flight #2109
Pacific Northwest, PDX-based
2002 C-36 mkII SR/FK M35B
Hi Pat,
Great minds think alike. I was originally thinking it was a leaky chainplate as well and we went over that area pretty heavily, etc... In short, there's no evidence at the settee, like you'd expect, and we tested for moisture in the deck without any luck, etc...
So, we took a closer look and looked at the bottom of the head's door and it was also water damaged, and you can see where the water overflowed from the head pan, over the threshold and under the corner of the sole (also damaged) into the bilge... Though, there's no other "flood" evidence except for the head area (no other floor boards, cabinets, etc...)
So, I think we are safe in terms of chainplates/deck. ;^>
Thanks for taking the time to reply. So great to be part of an active/helpful membership. (One reason that I won't miss our Hans Christian...)
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
There have been a number of posts about replacing the cabin sole so without going into details here, if the PO had water leakage, pull up the sole and see if the bottoms are damaged. They aren't cheap to replace. As we all know, our friends at Catalina didn't seem to think it was necessary to seal the undersides of the sole boards.
Chuck Parker
HelenRita 2072 Mk II
2002 Tall Rig - Winged Keel
Atlantic Highlands, NJ
I agree with Pat and Steve. The likely source of the bulkhead damage is a chain plate leak. C36’s are very prone to this problem. Around 2002 Catalina modified the through deck chain plate, which I assume was to address this issue.
Look at the underside of the chain plates in side the cabin. There will be evidence of previous leakage between the shroud plate and the hull liner, a line of rust between the plate and fiberglass. Has any of the varnish lifted high up on the bulkhead ? This is another sign of moisture coming through the chain plates.
Get a moisture meter and check the moisture content around the chain plates. You can get a good meter for around $150 (Electrophysics, Model CT33). A lot cheaper than paying the surveryor $800 to tell you the same thing.
How to use [url]http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/moisture_meter[/url]
[/B]
Nile Schneider
Mañana C36 #1798
Lake Champlain, VT
VermontSailor - We did end up testing the entire bulkhead with a Lignomat meter and didn't really find anything of interest/concern. (And this was after a 3-day rain in Seattle...) That said, yep - one of the first projects we'll be doing is rebedding all of the chainplates. (I had an 88 mki years ago that leaked horribly when I bought her...)
Though, there was definitely some moisture in forward bulkhead between the head and the vberth on the starboard side. I'll be tracing that soon enough... Thanks again....
__________________
Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
Lignomat meter is a meter that checks the electrical resistance of wood to determine moisture content with two probes that contact the wood. The Electrophysics makes a non-contact measurement using capacitance. It can detect moisture in deck coring behind a layer of fiberglass, without drilling holes. Checking the entire bulkhead won’t tell you much about leaking chain plates. Water from the chain plates will work its way to the bottom edge of the bulkhead and floor via the hull liner and edge of the bulkhead.
The bigger issue for you is to make sure the deck core is not wet. Once it is wet it can not be dried out and will eventually rot. Especially if the boat has been in a warm climate for a length of time. Even if the chain plate leaks had been fixed, it could be too late for the core. Very expensive fix, compared to replacing the bulkhead.
Nile Schneider
Mañana C36 #1798
Lake Champlain, VT
Nile - Yep, but Lingomat is all I had from my woodworking days.
Though, I checked with the surveyor (who, of course, did use a capacitance meter) and he was pretty satisfied. The only moisture he was concerned with was a 16% in the port bulkhead (though, inboard of the chainplate). And, there's a little spot above the head, outboard to port of the hatch there that registered at 18% (though, no de-lam of any sort), but I'm pretty comfortable with dealing with that appropriately...
All in all, I'm actually pretty happy with how she surveyed out, but we did haggle and haggle on price until we got to a point that would make it pretty easy to cover the cost of any "worst case" scenario. (Seriously, I almost feel bad admitting how much we haggled, etc...)
The boat will be officially be ours this weekend, but it'll be a couple of weeks before I have time to deliver her back to our home port... Can't wait (7-8 bridges and the Ballard Locks.) Then - a winter of fun projects (starting with adding a Webasto 5500).
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
Congratulations.
You may want to consider adding upgraded chainplate cover that Catalina had created to get a getter seal. Part number 24263. See attachment. They were $8.00 each a couple years ago. Contact Kent Nelson at Catalina, [email]kent@catalinayachts.com[/email]
Nile Schneider
Mañana C36 #1798
Lake Champlain, VT
Steve, what is/will be your home port?
Larry Brandt
S/V High Flight #2109
Pacific Northwest, PDX-based
2002 C-36 mkII SR/FK M35B
Nile - Sweet! Thanks for the tip... I was thinking of having something similar fabricated, but this will obviously be a heck of a lot easier!
Larry - We are up on Bainbridge Island, WA (If you're ever up this way and want to go for a sail (or grab a beer) let me know...)
Cheers!
__________________
Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
[quote=VermontSailor;10676]Congratulations.
You may want to consider adding upgraded chainplate cover that Catalina had created to get a getter seal. Part number 24263. See attachment. They were $8.00 each a couple years ago. Contact Kent Nelson at Catalina, [EMAIL="kent@catalinayachts.com"]kent@catalinayachts.com[/EMAIL][/quote]
I emailed Kent this morning, the price has gone up to $9 bucks! The horror! ;)
I ordered 6 of them, looks like a big time improvement over what we've got now.
Yeah, I got a hold of Kent as well. He had me email my order to [email]dani@catalinayachts.com[/email]...
Glad to see these *before* I re-bedded everything, etc... Thanks, Nile!
__________________
Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B