Crack in rudder.

15 posts / 0 new
Last post
jhenderson
Offline
Joined: 1/9/14
Posts: 81
Crack in rudder.

New Catalina 36 owner here, first post! I won't even get it until Spring, but I noted that there was a crack in the rudder. Since the vessel will be 4 hours from my home, I'm considering dropping the rudder and bringing it home to thoroughly dry it out and repair it.

Any tips, tricks, or dire warnings before I do it? I plan on either jacking it up or rigging a harness so I can slowly drop it. My wife will be down there making sure things are going smoothly, and I will be blocking it so I can slowly remove the blocks as I lower it.

Thanks!

Hummina
1987 Catalina 36 MKI
#741
Bayfield, WI. Usually. 

pierview
Offline
Joined: 9/27/09
Posts: 584

What do you mean by a "crack"?..... is the gel coat just cracked or is the rudder cracked thru? I've never done it but I don't think it's that easy to take out the rudder. You'll probably have to lift the boat.

You don't say where you are . If you're in a warm area where things aren't frozen, I've seen people drill drain holes in the bottom of the rudder, then let it drain for a good long time before re-plugging the holes (and fixing the leakage area).

If your just getting the boat, wasn't this caught in the survey?

Chuck Parker
HelenRita 2072 Mk II
2002 Tall Rig - Winged Keel
Atlantic Highlands, NJ

jhenderson
Offline
Joined: 1/9/14
Posts: 81

It was caught on the survey. But when you can get a boat with some minor issues for a ridiculously low price, you jump at it!

The crack is in the gel coat. it's about a foot long, there doesn't appear to be any delamitation, just a little water intrusion. I'm having it delivered to Northern Wisconsin in Spring, so it will be on the hard initially. She has some blisters I will be addressing too. The nice part about dropping the rudder is the that I'll be able to work on it at my leisure on weeknights. I have an exhaust riser to repair as well, so the more time I can spend working on things on weeknights at home, the better my time is budgeted on weekends.

Hummina
1987 Catalina 36 MKI
#741
Bayfield, WI. Usually. 

jhenderson
Offline
Joined: 1/9/14
Posts: 81

I didn't consider the lifting aspect. I know the rudder is about a foot shorter than the keel. Does anyone know how much higher it needs to go? Should I have them double block the keel, or does it require more height than that?

Hummina
1987 Catalina 36 MKI
#741
Bayfield, WI. Usually. 

TomSoko's picture
TomSoko
Offline
Joined: 2/15/07
Posts: 978

jhenderson,
Welcome! You will LOVE your new boat. It does everything well. One thing you can do to help us help you is to create a "signature" for your posts. It should include some info about you and your boat. More specifically, the year and/or hull #. Check some of the other posts to get an idea of what should be included. You can add a signature by clicking on the "User CP" link in the blue bar above, and follow the instructions. MkI boats have a longer rudder post than MkII boats do. Hope this helps.

Tom Sokoloski
C36/375IA Past Commodore
Noank, CT

jhenderson
Offline
Joined: 1/9/14
Posts: 81

Thanks for the tip! (posting to see if it worked)

Hummina
1987 Catalina 36 MKI
#741
Bayfield, WI. Usually. 

deising's picture
deising
Offline
Joined: 11/3/08
Posts: 1351

Well, J, if you think it best to take the rudder home, you should either ensure the boat is blocked high enough (is that riskier?) or plan to dig a hole (not sure if or when you can do that).

I wish I could tell you how much the rudder will drop before the post clears the hull. I guess it could easily be 18-24 inches or more.

Duane Ising - Past Commodore (2011-2012)
s/v Diva Di
1999 Catalina 36 Hull #1777
Std rig; wing keel, M35B, Delta (45#)
Punta Gorda, FL
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/diva-di/

baysailor2000's picture
baysailor2000
Offline
Joined: 5/16/10
Posts: 218

I had to remove my rudder to install a new shaft. The boat had to be lifted. I would imaging you need at least 24". You can measure that by estimating the length of the rudder post from hull to the top of the post. Then see how much room there is at the bottom .

Haro Bayandorian, 1999 C36 MKII, Sail La Vie #1787, M35B,
Coyote Point, San Mateo, CA.

Ciscocat's picture
Ciscocat
Offline
Joined: 6/25/07
Posts: 244

Hi and welcome
I recently replaced my rudder with a new one. I don't know how the boat is situated but if it is on the hard you would best served by getting a travel lift to tilt the back of the boat up and the front of the boat a bit down. It's not hard to remove it the only thing that is holding it on is the rudder post head and the wheel quadrant. It may be a bit difficult to remove the bolts holding the quadrant on since you are dealing with two dissimilar metals but it should come apart without to much effort. If you don't have a wing keel then I I believe you will need to raise the back at least 24~36 inches above where it sits. I don't recall exactly I just remember it seemed like the travel lift was about as high as it would go. Best of luck. BTW I didn't think I had a real problem till pull the rudder off, I was wrong

Mike Hogan
s/v Ciscocat #226
Mark I XP25, std rig

GaryB's picture
GaryB
Offline
Joined: 10/26/08
Posts: 571

I have had my rudder off twice and I did it in the yard. If you are on Jack stands all you have to do is raise it a little at a time. I can't tell you how much I think about 4-6", but it worked for me. The hardest part is the collar at the top of the rudder post located under the deck plate. There is a bolt that goes through it. The problem I had was the collar was frozen on the rudder post and there is not that much room to fetch it with anything. I ended up using a dremel tool with a cut off wheel and cut the collar.

Next you are going to have to go below decks through the aft cabin and get the steering quadrant apart. You should probably get the collar off and the quadrant off first before you start jacking the boat. You should also block the rudder while you are disassembling. The rudder weighs a bit and perhaps you should have a friend vs. your wife tend to that job. Actually both times I did it alone. Before you start jacking take the blocking from the rudder and drop the rudder to the ground, then start jacking. You can also dig a hole if you are on soft ground and avoid the jacking.
Have fun and Good Luck!

Gary Bain
S/V "Gone With The Wind"
Catalina 36', Hull #: 1056, Year: 1990, Engine: M-35
Standard Rig
Moored: Boothbay Harbor, Maine
Home: Auburn, Maine

tgrover's picture
tgrover
Offline
Joined: 1/5/08
Posts: 131

On your C36, hull #741 the rudder post will extend 35 3/8" above the top of the rudder. That is according to info from Catalina Yachts and my own experience.

Tom & Janis Grover

C36 #0949
SR/WK, M25XP
Midland, ON

Ciscocat's picture
Ciscocat
Offline
Joined: 6/25/07
Posts: 244

That sounds about right for a mark one the rudder extends to partially through the lazarithe which is a bit higher than how a mark2 is configured

Mike Hogan
s/v Ciscocat #226
Mark I XP25, std rig

jhenderson
Offline
Joined: 1/9/14
Posts: 81

[QUOTE=tgrover;21371]On your C36, hull #741 the rudder post will extend 35 3/8" above the top of the rudder. That is according to info from Catalina Yachts and my own experience.[/QUOTE]

I knew this web page would come in handy. But I had no idea I would get this detailed of an answer! Thanks!

Hummina
1987 Catalina 36 MKI
#741
Bayfield, WI. Usually. 

HowLin's picture
HowLin
Offline
Joined: 1/12/12
Posts: 355

I am not totally sure how the Catalina rudders are fabricated; but I do have experience with that kind of rudder repair on my previous boat - a Newport 30 and all I can say is - good luck! (and here is why...)
The rudder used to 'weep' water for 2-3 days after being put on the hard.
I removed the rudder and then removed some glass and gel coat around the cracked area, then re-glassed and barrier coated, before painting.
Two years later had a tough crossing of Georgia Strait in 25 knots close-hauled. On getting to our marina did a 90 deg turn at the dock and the boat kept going straight. :eek: Rudder stock had broken from the frame inside the rudder!! Had a new rudder built from scratch - it worked better than the old one ever did (less weather helm, etc (more balanced)

My point is: You can repair the crack and if you're confident no water has made it's way into the rudder you should be fine - but you can never know if there has been corrosion inside; and to what extent....

---- Howard & Linda Matwick ----

--- S/V "Silhouette" - Nanaimo, BC ----

--- 1999  C36 MkII  #1776 M35BC ---

Rob Kyles's picture
Rob Kyles
Offline
Joined: 6/15/08
Posts: 172

[QUOTE=HowLin;21392] - but you can never know if there has been corrosion inside; and to what extent....[/QUOTE]

That's largely true...

But we found a way - we noticed a small crack weeping rusty water, about 300mm below the 'notch' in the rudder. I lowered it with a 12mm line (photo) and drilled a circular hole to investigate. There is a MILD steel plate with holes to lighten it welded to the SS rudder stock. Ours looked OK, so I dried it and bogged it up.

We then sailed from New Zealand to Tonga, Fiji and New Caledonia, late 2012.

I noticed the 'bog' failed, and rusty water came out the whole circle of the patch. We hauled out in Noumea and had the whole shebang ground out and all new filler and a heavy fibreglass bandage put on. It appears a PO had run aground and bent the rudder - then did a cheap fix with a light skin of glass. Our rudder was just about to break off level with the bottom of the stock!

 

S.V. Wind Star

Rob & Margie Kyles:    Auckland ,New Zealand
Mk I  Hull #105 1983   Std Rig, Std Keel

 

Attachments
Log in or register to post comments