ASym rigging question

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rtrinkle
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ASym rigging question

My wife and I recently upgraded to a 1995 C36 MKII #1433 from a widow, and are thoroughly enjoying the boat. There were many extras included with the boat, including a ASym Spinnaker with some additional hardware. It looks like the previous owner began working on installing the ASym, but did not complete the project.

We have an additional cleat in the middle of the foredeck (most likely for securing the ASym tack line , and 2 additional foot blocks with jam cleats (not installed). We suspect these were for the ASym. Our question comes by installing these foot blocks. Since they are the same size as the headsail footblocks, we were going to stack them, putting the Spin foot blocks on top of the genoa foot blocks.

To do this, we can access the port side footblock nuts from the overhead of the cockpit locker, but cannot see how to access the starboard side footblock nuts. There doesn't appear to be access from the lazarette, and not accessible from the aft cabin.

How is the starboard footblock secured to the deck? Is there a glass imbedded backing plate that is tapped to secure the bolts? Do I need to cut the lining in the aft cabin and put in an access port?

Or should I think about installing the additional footblocks between the genoa footblocks and aft cleats (in no mans land)?

Thanks for all the info on this site. We use it significantly. Look forward to hearing your suggestions.

Robert Trinkle
Troubador, 1995 C36 MKII #1433, SR/WK
Universal M35A
Kinsale Harbor Marina
Kinsale, VA

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deising
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Going by memory for our 1999 boat, I believe there is a plastic deck plate in the aft cabin on starboard that gives you (limited) access to the block you reference.

Duane Ising - Past Commodore (2011-2012)
s/v Diva Di
1999 Catalina 36 Hull #1777
Std rig; wing keel, M35B, Delta (45#)
Punta Gorda, FL
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/diva-di/

BudStreet
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Posts: 1127

Are these the blocks on the sloping part of the deck about halfway down the cockpit? I would call them turning blocks with my limited knowledge of block names. If so on our '95 that side appears to be blind, the other side is accessible from the port cockpit lazarette.

I had to put a brace there for the wind gen/outboard lift and I could not find a way into that area without cutting from the bottom which I did not want to do. I drilled an exploratory hole and found it is hollow, I poked around with a chopstick, there was about 4 or 5" of clearance before I would hit what I think would be the inner liner in the aft cabin. The glass in that area was very thick and I did not see plywood core, just some type of bulky composite material. I ended up mounting my brace using SS lag bolts rather than cutting an access hole from below, they bit hard and took a lot of torque without stripping so there's good solid material in the deck there. I think this is the only place on our boat I haven't been able to get into, so far at least.

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rtrinkle
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Yes, I am talking about the blocks that are approx. 3/4" tall, 5-6" long, and about 4" wide. Its the block the headsail sheet goes through just before the winch.

Did the current block seem to have a backing plate?

So there seems to be a 4-5" gap between the inside lining and the deck above? I also heard the decks were very thick and did not have a wood core. We have no access plate from the aft cabin, I suppose it would be good idea to put one there, if not for any reason but maintenance on the winch.

How thick do you think the fiberglass deck is there?

I am interested in seeing/hearing more about your wind generator. Do you have any pictures of the installation? We are contemplating getting some sort of battery charging array, whether solar/wind gen, or both..

Robert Trinkle
Troubador, 1995 C36 MKII #1433, SR/WK
Universal M35A
Kinsale Harbor Marina
Kinsale, VA

BudStreet
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Joined: 9/4/09
Posts: 1127

[quote=rtrinkle;15282]
Did the current block seem to have a backing plate?
[/quote]

I couldn't tell I was just poking around in a bolthole with a chopstick. I would expect it does but can't confirm that.

[quote=rtrinkle;15282]
So there seems to be a 4-5" gap between the inside lining and the deck above? I also heard the decks were very thick and did not have a wood core. Since there is no access plate from the aft cabin, I suppose it would be good idea to put one there, if not for any reason but maintenance on the winch.
[/quote]

The decks on our boat are 1 1/4" thick. The decks are cored with plywood though there is very little, I think it is 3/8", at least when I ground out the core around the stanchion bolts that was the height of grinder bit I used. By contrast our C28 had a deck about an inch thick and the core was 5/8 or 3/4". The C36 has a lot more composite in the decks than the C28 had.

I think an access plate back there would be a good idea. I was going to cut one in but was under a lot of time pressure when I did all that work so I didn't do it. At some point in time I probably will, I don't like lag bolts and don't like things I can't get at.

[quote=rtrinkle;15282]
How thick do you think the fiberglass deck is there?
[/quote]

At least an inch and a quarter as I recall, maybe more. It's possible there is plywood core in there but what came out from drilling was all white.

[quote=rtrinkle;15282]
I am interested in seeing/hearing more about your wind generator. Did you install it there, or somewhere else? Do you have any pictures of the installation? We are contemplating getting some sort of battery charging array, whether solar/wind gen, or both..[/quote]

Attached is a photo of how we mounted the wind gen and solar panel. It's a 220 watt panel and between it, the 200 watt wind gen and our normal 1 hour of motor running with our 90 amp alternator to get in and out of anchorages every day we are fine for power. Also have a 2 Kw gen but haven't needed it yet. But we are careful with power and our fridge has had additional insulation added so the compressor only runs 1/3 of the time.

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rtrinkle
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Nice looking.. is the wind gen and support rods outside the life lines? Were the mounts provided with the wind gen?

Our Edson davits are much lower than yours (waist high when standing in the cockpit), so we were thinking of putting the solar panel mounts above the bimini.

How did you route the wires to the battery? Any schematics and/or configuration?

Back to original discussion-
I suppose either stacking the turn blocks, or mounting individually further aft, closer to the aft cleats, but that might limit future wind gen installation. So stacking might be the best way. But would stacking the turn blocks put the Asym sheets to far forward?

We actually flew our Asym this past weekend, putting the sheets through the aft cleats and back up to the winch. It worked well, but I would be interested to know how strong that configuration is ( apparent wind was 3.5 knots, and we were moving 3.2 knots). In heavier winds I wouldn't want to pull the cleats away from the deck.

Robert Trinkle
Troubador, 1995 C36 MKII #1433, SR/WK
Universal M35A
Kinsale Harbor Marina
Kinsale, VA

BudStreet
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Joined: 9/4/09
Posts: 1127

[quote=rtrinkle;15289]Nice looking.. is the wind gen and support rods outside the life lines? Were the mounts provided with the wind gen?
[/quote]

Main mount is inside the pushpit through the seat and it's bolted to the railing. The starboard support rod is inside the lifeline, the aft one is parallel to the railings. Southwest Windpower makes an rubber insulated mounting hardware kit and I got that but the entire mount itself was custom built by a SS shop, it also is our outboard motor lift.

[quote=rtrinkle;15289]
Our Edson davits are much lower than yours (waist high when standing in the cockpit), so we were thinking of putting the solar panel mounts above the bimini.
[/quote]

That's a good plan as well, Duane Ising, the C36IA Commodore has his mounted in both places. We get more power from the solar and it is totally quiet, the wind gen is much quieter than old ones but it would be foolish to say you won't hear it. You will and if you are an aft cabin sleeper or a light sleeper it will bug you. I don't mind the sound but my better half disagrees, so we never run it at night. Solar won't keep your batteries charged when it's cloudy, so I hedged my bets with both. We wanted the davits high to use the swim platform without having to lower the dinghy for a swim, plus to keep it out of the water when heeling.

[quote=rtrinkle;15289]
How did you route the wires to the battery? Any schematics and/or configuration?
[/quote]

There are conduits in the aft cabin. Look inside your aft cabin hanging locker on the aft side, you will see several conduits, they come out in the starboard aft lazarette. Quite easy to snake wires through there. Try to keep the 12V and 110V runs separate.

[quote=rtrinkle;15289]
Back to original discussion-
I suppose either stacking the turn blocks, or mounting individually further aft, closer to the aft cleats, but that might limit future wind gen installation. So stacking might be the best way. But would stacking the turn blocks put the Asym sheets to far forward?

We actually flew our Asym this past weekend, putting the sheets through the aft cleats and back up to the winch. It worked well, but I would be interested to know how strong that configuration is ( apparent wind was 3.5 knots, and we were moving 3.2 knots). In heavier winds I wouldn't want to pull the cleats away from the deck.
[/quote]

I'm not the right person to comment on block location, some of the others here are racers and will be better able to answer that. For me I know it would be fine. I wouldn't worry about pulling a cleat out of the deck, these boats are very well built and I've never heard any stories of cleats being pulled out of the deck from any reason. Cleats have to be very strongly attached since the entire load of the boat can end up on one of them.

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rtrinkle
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Posts: 203

Great info, thanks for the info on the wind gen. Looks like a very good situation.

We didn't choose the davits, they conveyed with the boat, and are high enough to keep the dingy out of the water when healing.

I'll probably hold off on mounting the extra blocks at this moment. Right now we are watching Hurricane Sandy very close.

Robert Trinkle
Troubador, 1995 C36 MKII #1433, SR/WK
Universal M35A
Kinsale Harbor Marina
Kinsale, VA

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