My boat has two sheaves on front and two sheaves on back - I have seen a few people set up the topping lift as you describe.

I sort of did the opposite. I kept the fixed wire coming down but just added a 2:1 purchase and a cleat between the wire and the end of the boom, with nothing running forward along the boom or to the cabintop. I can stand on the cockpit seat and adjust this much more easiy than the stock setup forward, and it is simpler than running a full second halyard. I do keep a messenger line run over the extra halyard sheave just in case.

Not applicable to your boat, Matthew, but our 1999 model has a solid boom vang, so that the topping lift exists only to make the Dutchman system work, and as a backup if the solid vang would ever fail somehow, I guess.

When we replace the main, I plan to add lazy jacks and something like a Stack Pack to make it easier to use the main. Right now, the dutchman makes the mainsail cover complicated and more time consuming to use.

I wonder if any MK I owners have converted to a solid vang.

Duane,
This MkI owner converted to Garhauer vang and got rid of the topping lift after only one season of ownership. A buddy of mine just added a MackPack (similar to stack pack, but made by Mack Sails?), and he absolutely loves it. Lazy jacks (attached to the MackPack) fully gather the sail, and he can pull the zipper closed at his convenience at the dock. Combined with a Garhauer rigid vang, it is a great setup. With the need for a topping lift, special adjustments to the cover, and monofilament that breaks too often, for the life of me I can't understand why people use a Dutchman system. But that's just me.....

Well, just to provide the other side of the coin, we kind of like the Dutchman system, it works better than lazy jacks in our experience. Our sail cover just has two zippers in it for the lines and it's not a big problem to put on. I changed the mono last year, took a couple of adjustments to get it right but since then it's been fine. One boat we chartered in the VI's had a stack pack and the damn reefing lines and/or battens would hang up somewhere almost every time we hoisted the main. Maybe a bad design, I dunno, but it wasn't impressive. So far the Dutchman has worked best, for us.

I had a Doyle stack pack installed last year and love it

[QUOTE=Chachere;20312]Curious why you find the cover that much more difficult to put on (I understand from my canvas guy that he'd just have to add 2 zippers to accommodate the lines for a Dutchman).[/QUOTE]

Well, I admit that it isn't ALL that bad, but my cover is 14 years old and the zipper is sticky, the slits for the 2 Dutchman lines have a snap top and bottom and velcro in between, and reaching the aft portion of the boom is difficult for me. Compared to what my friends with the Stack Pack or Mack Pack have to do, it is a lot of work.

Bud,
Viva la differance!!!

[quote=deising;20318] reaching the aft portion of the boom is difficult for me. [/quote]

That's the worst part of putting it on. I can make that easier if I pull the traveller over to one side but in the time it takes to do that I can just lean out over/leaning on the dodger, pull the boom over and slog away at it. Which draws me dirty looks and harsh words from the admiral whose job it is to keep the sunbrella looking nice and keeping out water.

I like the idea of the stack pack but it just hasn't percolated up the list enough to do anything about it.

So this thread got hijacked. To get back to the original question, do the Mk I's not have two sheaves at the back of the masthead? On our Mk II we have two front and two back sheaves. At the back, one is for the main halyard and the other one is for the topping lift tail, which goes down maybe 3-4 feet and then attaches to the double continuous line for the Dutchman system. The topping lift/dutchman double line seems a simple enough system and it works well for reefing with our single line reefing. The single line reefing itself was not great until we added blocks on the sail, now it works very well.

My cover doesn't have zippers or slits in it. I lower the Dutchman lines all the way and run then back along the boom. They are then held in place where the cover goes around the tang for the topping lift. When the cover is removed, I raise the Dutchman lines all the way, after removing the cover. This is the way it came rigged from the factory.

Our MKI #432 has two sheaves.

I am currently getting the halyard installed for the Dutchman system that came on the used main I bought. The sailmaker (Quantum) recommended a setup like what was described. He said they really like the Dutchman because it is so adjustable and recommend it for cruisers. I am also thinking of installing a Boomkicker to go with the Vang I already have.

A question for bstreet: where and how on the sail did you install the blocks to ease reefing? I have an issue with our single line system. I can't get the leech cringle down close and tight enough to the boom to keep the boom off of the dodger. We have had the boat only one season to date. Love it but this is one of the irritants I'm trying to work out. I was actually considering abandoning the system and adding cheek blocks and cleats on the boom as I had on our previous boat and which worked quite well. I didn't mind going to the mast to reef. thks Alain

Alex,
Instead of a Boomkicker, you might want to consider replacing your current soft vang with a Garhauer rigid vang. It's possibly a little more money, but it is worth it. There's a reason that it comes standard with most/all new boats. Just a thought.

[quote=Alain Croteau;20368]A question for bstreet: where and how on the sail did you install the blocks to ease reefing? I have an issue with our single line system. I can't get the leech cringle down close and tight enough to the boom to keep the boom off of the dodger. We have had the boat only one season to date. Love it but this is one of the irritants I'm trying to work out. I was actually considering abandoning the system and adding cheek blocks and cleats on the boom as I had on our previous boat and which worked quite well. I didn't mind going to the mast to reef. thks Alain[/quote]

Alain, the blocks go on the sail where the reefing lines pass through. There are short lengths of nylon webbing with a SS ring in each end of them in the grommet for the reefing line, the block is attached to those straps. It cuts the friction way down and we have no problem keeping the boom up when reefed. I was going to put blocks on the leech as well but found we didn't need them, just adding them at the mast was enough. Everything is led back to the cockpit for both reefs.

Reefing works very well now, I just stand in the companionway and winch the reefing line down as I let the main halyard slip, the traveller is dropped to take the load off the sail and the topping lift supports the boom for the short time it takes to reef.

We had to do this maneuver last year passing through Kingston during the zoo called CORK. In the midst of the confusion of mass fleets of dinghies going in unpredictable directions the West wind jumped from about 18 kts to gusts above 35 kts in the blink of an eye. With the big, sharp swells coming in off the lake that day no way I would have wanted to go forward to reef.

I've been meaning to add blocks as described by Larry for some time; the friction in the system without them, can be considerable. I think I'll add the webbing for the blocks over the winter; nice to hear that they only need to go on the forward end to be effective.

On more than one occasion, I've eased the halyard too much, and broken one or more of the plastic slugs that attach the sail to the mast. Since then, I've found the following to be effective at solving that problem.

On a windless day, I raise the main and hand tighten the first reef line. Then tighten the halyard. Winch the reef line tighter, watching to be sure it doesn't get so low as to pull on the sail slugs, raising the halyard if necessary. Once I have both set so that the reef cringle is still a few inches above the stack of sail slugs, I mark the halyard, either with a permanent marker or (better) some colored thread stitched through the line. Once that is done, when I need to reef, I drop the halyard to the mark, then tighten the reefing line until the foot of the sail is properly set. Then tighten the halyard as needed for the final set.

This setup allows me to reef pretty quickly, without worrying about having to repair broken sail slugs.

I installed these 40mm Harken soft attach carbo air blocks to the leach and luff of my main sail reefing grommets. They attach to the grommet with spectra line so there are no rings and no webbing required. They work very well and don't have any chafe problems on the sail. You may want to consider these for your reefing system.

Good info folks re adding blocks to ease reefing - thks. (apologize for the divergence from the original issue).
Bud and Suzanne - in the conditions you described, reefing the main over the 26 yrs we sailed our previous boat (douglas32) wasn't too bad but fore sail changes were at times brutal. Was nice to have roller furling the last 5 yrs.

Re: reefing blocks in the main. I did this after reading a detail description in the C 380 section of the August, 2004, Mainsheet on page T8. The article indicated the model of Harken blocks used and the correct sized stainless steel rings. The system really reduces friction. The luff of the main comes down easy; to get the leach tight to the boom usually takes some manuel help.

Any C380 folks have a link to this online, or could scan and post?

somewhere on this thread, I believe someone discussed wanting to add a solid boom vang. I was just browsing through the classifieds, and found someone selling one; looks like it might be a salvage situation.

[url]http://www.c36ia.com/ed-classified/tid/21[/url]

How do you avoid this and pull the cringle forward when you guys have added blocks at the tack ? 

How do you avoid this and pull the cringle forward when you guys have added blocks at the tack ?