Started my fall project yesterday of extending the boom to 14'3" on my standard rig boat. Anyone else done this? I get lee helm up to about 8 knots of breeze, and I always think the boat needs more sail area, so this seemed like a natural step for now. I cut and built the extension yesterday, now I need to go back and cut all the appropriate holes. Will update on the final results.
We hit the race course again in November but I don't think I'll have a bigger mainsail yet by then. I picked my boom length to make J/105 mainsails fit on with only a little tweaking (they are still a bit too tall for my mast).
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Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Jason,
THAT should be interesting! I can't wait to see some pix.
Tom Sokoloski
C36/375IA Past Commodore
Noank, CT
But Jason, what does that do to your class? Your PHRF?
Larry Brandt
S/V High Flight #2109
Pacific Northwest, PDX-based
2002 C-36 mkII SR/FK M35B
It'll cost me 3-6 seconds of PHRF - which is perfect as I'm precariously hanging on the slow edge of the division I want to sail in. No one else races a Cat 36 in town, and the closest two boats that I might meet up with one day are both tall rig boats.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Here she is with long boom in place - but still the old 12.5' foot mainsail - winning the New Year's Day race in approx zero knots of wind. Finished ahead of a J/33!
Just found the new bigger main, not recut yet but its coming.
[IMG]http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8514/8362391262_34f0225e39_k.jpg[/IMG]
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Anyone need a kevlar tape drive mainsail?
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Jason, what kind of shape is it in?
Looks like the kind of drifter day we had Sunday in Nanaimo...
Also I'm thinking of getting a used 10 - 18 forespar whisker pole. Do you think that size will work for me?
---- Howard & Linda Matwick ----
--- S/V "Silhouette" - Nanaimo, BC ----
--- 1999 C36 MkII #1776 M35BC ---
[QUOTE=HowLin;16119]Jason, what kind of shape is it in?
Looks like the kind of drifter day we had Sunday in Nanaimo...
Also I'm thinking of getting a used 10 - 18 forespar whisker pole. Do you think that size will work for me?[/QUOTE]
To your first question - Not Good.
To the second, I have no idea, never use whisker poles. I think 18' would be fine for smaller jibs, probably inadequate for a 155% with a 22' foot measurement, but that depends on what sails you carry.
My spinnaker pole is 15' and it can be used as a whisker for the 100% jib but doesn't work well for the genoa.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
I've only got a 135 and an assymetrical so I'll probably buy it, as the price is right.
---- Howard & Linda Matwick ----
--- S/V "Silhouette" - Nanaimo, BC ----
--- 1999 C36 MkII #1776 M35BC ---
Well we raced yesterday with the new big (BIG) mainsail and results are in - the boat is hugely improved upwind in every way.
I ended up with a J/105 mainsail, cut down the luff a bit to fit the boat, and then went back and took 3" off the roach at the 3/4 height to make it clear the backstay a bit better.
But what a difference. Noticeably, in the 6-8 knots of wind we were in, I had about 1/2 a spoke of weather helm dialed in to the wheel, instead of zero helm or lee helm that I would get before. The 105 main is quite flat and I was able to carry the boom about 4" above centerline with the leech nearly touching the backstay at the second batten from the top and the main sheeted in what seemed impossibly far, but the telltales still flying.
In turn, having the main so far to weather allowed us to sheet the genoa in further than we used to - typically I would have said it stalls out with the leech about 4" off the spreader tip, but we brought that distance down to about 1".
All added together, these subtle differences allowed us to point with or above every boat we got near. Observations are limited to very flat water and a medium breeze, but certainly we have raced against these same boats enough to know when we have made a change, and this was a dramatic improvement.
Now excited to see how it fares in some other conditions. This has been a pretty big project from start to finish but going on this initial sail it has been the biggest improvement to our boat since buying it and I'm very pleased.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Nice !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
Carl - do you have a pdf of your PHRF certificate by any chance - I'm interested in seeing the sail area and measurement numbers on the tall rig boats to see how I compare.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Jason,
Awesome! Glad to hear your changes worked!!!
Tom Sokoloski
C36/375IA Past Commodore
Noank, CT
Here is a link to my last certificate
[url]http://www.phrfsef.com/pages/2011/Ratings/Glory%20Daze_2011.pdf[/url]
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
My kite is 1100 sq ft
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
Just got our 2013 PHRF with the new configuration - attached. I am running 1100 sq foot kites so about the same as a Tall rig boat, and the big main. I believe that locally a tall rig would rate 145 so I'm still getting a bit of a break from them.
Someone on Saltspring just got a Mk 2 TR boat and is racing it our local Easter regatta, but I'll be sailing on a different boat. Hopefully I'll get to line up with them or Mata Hari some time in the next year and find out where we really stand.
GloryDaze, running a 140% genoa we are probably putting up almost exactly the same sail area, albeit in different configurations Shame we'll never get to put the two boats side by side.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Those are some interesting numbers, you have the P measurement of the standard rig but the E measurement of the tall rig at 13. Also you list the displacement at 15000, curious where you got that number. Did you have the boat weighed? Catalina list the fin displacement at 13,500
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
Those are the 'standard' numbers from the PHRF database up here - I noted the same issues but didn't see the point in fighting it. What is interesting is that the 1983 brochures list the boat at 15,500, the 1985 brochures list the boat at 13,500, and the consensus among owners is that the boats start around 17+...
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
I feel your pain, that's what we get racing phrf,but around here it's the only game in town. I'm certainly not about to pay to have my boat weighed on a certified scale.
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
The real test will be this weekend. We have two days and up to 9 races if the wind allows. Our division rates 100-149 with us at the slow end:
Peterson 35 (x2)
J/29
J/30
Abbot 36
Wilderness 30
Laser 28
The Petersons and the Laser are seriously well prepped windward - leeward specialists so I'll be shocked if we take them out, but we'll know where we stand performance wise by the end of Sunday I think.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Well add to that list a Santana 3030 and a custom IOR 34'er for a fleet of 10 boats and we had our work cut out. We only came 8 out of 10 after 7 races but had some major handling problems on day 1 and did 2 sets of penalty turns that surely cost us points. Upwind performance is definitely way improved from last year, now I have to stop leaving seconds on the table each time we tack. Best finish in that fleet was a 4th place which would have been impossible a year ago. I think there will be pics, I'll attach them once I find them.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
[IMG]http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag106/VanMelges24/IMG_1282_zpsb47d73...
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
[IMG]http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag106/VanMelges24/IMG_1231_zpsf8e181...
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
[IMG]http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag106/VanMelges24/IMG_1227_zps4441a6...
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Looking good, I think that sail plan has some potential. It looks like you sail in some confined areas, what kind of angles do you sail downwind? From the pictures it looks like maybe as high as 135 apparent in some light air. Have you tried sailing deeper? I know pictures dont tell the whole story, that's why I'm asking.
And what brand is the main, I don't remember seeing angled battens like that on anything around here.
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
One more thing,ditch the furler, we are faster with a deck sweeping 140 than with a furling 155.
Carl Wehe
1985 C36TM #443
Hillsboro Inlet,FL
Area - we sail in a pretty big bay (English Bay in Vancouver) but it is confined by a number of factors - all the wind is usually on the south edge so we race there, the shipping channel is on the north half and is best avoided. The race course area is FULL of anchored freighters, we never get a 1 mile beat that doesn't have a freighter on one layline or the other.
Downwind angles - I usually sail this boat uncomfortably deep but it in really light air we will get up into that 135 range occasionally. The really tricky thing here is that we have a 15 foot tidal range, so there is often a knot or more of current running through the course. When going downwind and downtide, it is quite common for the whole fleet to come in hot as they don't account enough for the current. I think generally I do a good job of this as I entered every mark rounding with an inside overlap last weekend. There was a lot of traffic around so we did spend time sailing angles just to keep clear air.
Furler - you're not wrong. I have always avoided furlers until this boat. I chose to cut the genoa for furler use mostly because we only need to change down to smaller headsails about once every year and a half, and because the majority of my crew were not, at the time, up to snuff for full racing setup. That genoa in the pics has a ton of foot round and does sweep the deck starting around the forward shrouds, not great but not terrible. I also think it is more efficient for single-handed racing which I do a lot of.
Frankly I would have hanked-on sails every time if I could choose. Single-handed they are the best setup hands down. With crew its debatable.
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Couple more pics that give you the whole perspective. The rig still looks (is) short in this boat but she goes upwind properly for sure. In fact we've been super successful this winter in a fleet where the rating spread is 21 up to 185. We are sailing at 149 and are leading the current series.
[IMG]https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/1465802_622517504...
[IMG]https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/966814_6225175144...
[IMG]https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/908_6225175644752...
Jason V
Vancouver, BC, Canada