Hi, Joel.

This isn't meant to be a criticism, but regardless of what the temp gauge read, did the engine feel warm or hot before you opened the 'radiator' cap? You normally never open a cap like that (under pressure) when the engine is anything but cool.

As for the engine not starting, the clue of 'no alarm' seems to indicate your 'ignition circuit' is not energized. You sure you have the battery switch to a battery bank and not off? Perhaps a fuse in that
circuit has blown.

I just re-read your post and it seems like you were alone and had to climb up into the cockpit to shut down the engine. You should find where the cable for the shutoff ends at the engine. That lever can possibly be actuated from there without having to climb over a running engine. Either way, it is a bit risky with that v-belt turning away.

Joel.
If your starter did not turn over I I would take and look at the purple wire which would be a spade connection on your starter. That maybe the issue as that may not have made a good connection.

I believe the fuse is in the same general area Randy mentioned.

If you have no power at all (i.e. any DC power to the boat), check your main fuses as well. These should be the hefty ones that are in-line right near (or on) your batteries.

[QUOTE=JAS;21137]Any ideas where the fuses all that water might have blown might be located? I took off the instrument panel in the cockpit, and I didn't see any behind there (although a couple of lightbulbs fell out of the back of some broken instrument brackets!). Are they perhaps located behind the nav station instrument panel? At the engine? It's hard to imagine that my electrical problem is related to anything other than what my radiator fluid sprayed on.[/QUOTE]

I.m going to guess that the electrical problem might not be related to the fluid leak at all -- that it preceded it, which would explain why the temp gauge wasn't indicating anything.

[QUOTE=deising;21136]As for the engine not starting, the clue of 'no alarm' seems to indicate your 'ignition circuit' is not energized. You sure you have the battery switch to a battery bank and not off? Perhaps a fuse in that circuit has blown. [/QUOTE]

Logically, it might very well be that the initial cause of the temp gauge not indicating properly would likely be the same reason that nothing else is happening, either -- that some fault is preventing the engine starting and control circuits from energizing. Certainly, the fact that "radiator fluid came spraying out on engine" would indicate that the engine was heating up normally (and I agree with Duane that opening a closed coolant cap on any engine that is already running is very risky and can cause some nasty burns -- DAMHIK).

I think you'll need to trace the power supply from the battery bank to the battery switch to the engine to the control panel one step at a time, testing at each point with a multimeter (or at least a 12V test lamp). Check the ground connection, too. You should be able to spot the point where power no longer is present (where it should be). Arm yourself with the wiring diagram, if necessary (available on the site at [url]www.c36ia.com/files/C36MkII_Owners_Manual.pdf[/url], see pages 66-68 - that would answer your question about fuses, by the way), but shouldn't be needed -- this is pretty straightforward.

[QUOTE=JAS;21143]I'm getting DC to lights, water pump, etc. But nothing happens at all when I try to start the engine, no alarm no nothing. A boat owner at the marina said my problem may be as simple as antifreeze residue creating enough resistance to break the circuit, such as where the ground wire attaches to the block. As I work my way back to the ground wire, I have been taking apart various terminals nearest the splash zone and wirebrushing them one by one, but so far no luck. Does anyone know what that large capacitor looking thing bolted to the wood just above the engine does? It was in the splash zone (along with a plug right below it that receives four wires) too.[/QUOTE]

The capacitor-like thing you describe is probably the solenoid for the glow plugs. Wasn't standard on earlier boats, like our MkI (although we added one), but I'm given to understand that the MkIIs generally have them, at least according to the wiring diagram at page 67 of the manual.

Again, I think you need to test using at least a test lamp; but multimeters are very inexpensive ($25 at Radio Shack) and an invaluable tool to have onboard, IMO. Start at the large [COLOR="Red"]red[/COLOR] cable attached to the alternator, which -- depending how things are wired, should come from either the battery switch or directly from the battery positive (hopefully with a fuse at the battery). If you have power there, keep tracing.

By the way, having now taken at glance at the wiring diagram for the MkII at page 68 of the manual ([url]www.c36ia.com/files/C36MkII_Owners_Manual.pdf[/url]) it appears that there is a 10amp breaker fed by what should be a 14 gauge [COLOR="DarkOrchid"]purple[/COLOR] wire in the control panel area, that feeds both the "I" terminal on the ignition switch as well as the "I" terminals on the instruments (our older Mk I doesn't have fuses or breakers at the control panel or engine area), and comes from terminal "7" on the terminal strip at the engine. But since you say that none of the alarm buzzers are sounding, I don't think that's the problem, since the buzzers are fed from a different wire (purple/black, coming from terminal 9). The diagram for the engine area (at page 67 of the manual) indicates two breakers in that area, one on what should be a 10 gauge [COLOR="Red"]red[/COLOR] wire running from the alternator output to #2 on the terminal strip (and thence to the "B" terminal on the ignition switch at the control panel; the other a 10 amp breaker coming from the "I" terminal on the glow plug solenoid feeding a 14 guage [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]light blue[/COLOR] wire that runs to #11 on the terminal strip (and thence the alarm buzzer) and a [COLOR="DarkOrchid"]purple[/COLOR] 14 gauge wire that runs to apparently to the fuel lift pump. Again, your boat is different from mine, so I'm just going by the diagrams, but I'd hunt for those breakers and test the power on either side of them to see what's cooking.

Jas
I dont know if you resolved your problem but I hope this helps .

Believe it or not. Last year I sailed over to watch my daughter race 420s. It was blazing hot out, everything ran fine and not a single issue.
Sailed into harbor, dropped the sails and motored into the mooring feild.

Later that night I went to take a shower, and wanted the engine to heat up the water a bit. Nothing she would not turn over, nothing, evrything else aboard did except the engine.

I was lucky there was a west marine in the harbor, I replaced the ingintion and key, checked every single DAmn wire connection, meter tested everything, I was so pissed I even threatened the boat in between every choice word I learned thoughout my USMC days and still nothing.

A friend happened to be going by and heard me having a meltdown, now it was hot and after running out of beer I was on the edge. He climbs aboard and looks down at me from the cockpit and says in his little whiney voice , Hey did you check that little in line fuse right there above the starter.
Again a gave him a little peice of my mind, he shook his head and said ya whatever check the inline fuse .

Well if it wasnt for him I would have propbaly been in the Pen for arson, seeing nothing else would work, and I tried evrything I could think of.

Low and behold I took a closer look sure as shit it was burned out, I cut it out replaced it with a waterproof fuse and all shrink wrap connectors. Made myself a very large cocktail, went up on deck turned the key, and she started right up, and to this day she has ran fine

So the moral of the story is, check everything, and always keep a open mind when something happens aboard.

Sometimes things are right there it justs takes a fresh set of eyes, the worst part was it cost me a large bottle of Kettle One and a aplogy which I did gracefully

Hope this helps

Like the yellow brick road, starting at the beginning is sometimes the best thing. My suggestion:

1. With a voltmeter, check the big red cable at the starter for battery voltage. If not OK, then check to make sure your engine battery switch is on.

2. Assuming here that you have battery voltage at the starter, so now check for battery voltage at the "B" terminal of your ignition switch. Should be a 10 gauge red wire. If not OK, then check to make sure your 20amp engine circuit breaker is on. This breaker might be located near battery switch. My guts are telling me this has tripped.

3. Assuming here that you have battery voltage at the "B" terminal of your ignition switch. Turn the switch to the first position. You should now have battery voltage at "I" terminal of your switch. Measure this and report back.

Our 20 amp engine circuit breaker is located on the back side of the engine by the electric fuel pump. It has "popped" twice in the 11 years we've had our boat for unknown reasons.

I had a somewhat similar situation- no power to any part of engine/engine controls, but other systems worked fine. In my case it turned out to be the engine block ground cable had fractured inside the crimped terminal. There was no outward visual sign of any problem. See if you have any cable play inside the crimp, our see if you can establish intermittent power when wiggling it. I also had the same issue on a crimped ground wire on car starter motor too.

Well, Joel, you may be getting a late start in learning some of this stuff, but it will pay big dividends. You will save money in repairs, gain confidence in your boat and your own ability to troubleshoot and fix things, and make yourself much more self-reliant when out cruising.

Best of luck and we look forward to reading about when you find the problem.

Two vital additions to everyone's tool box:

o A basic multimeter. $5 at Harbor Freight. Sometimes even for free.
o A couple of alligator clip leads.

Measuring voltage is easy and will be 99% of what you will use the meter for. All of your measurement will be between something and ground, so this is where an alligator clip will often come in handy. Measuring continuity or resistance (ohms) requires a bit more care as you can only do this when no power is present on what you're measuring. Finally, current measurement is advanced as you are working "in series" with a live circuit. Not for the timid. A good basic primer:

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bF3OyQ3HwfU[/url]

A very good book to have is Nigel Calders books ,not sure of the spelling,

[QUOTE=newguy;21163]Two vital additions to everyone's tool box:

o A basic multimeter. $5 at Harbor Freight. Sometimes even for free.
o A couple of alligator clip leads.

[/QUOTE]

and a 12V test lamp, available at any auto-parts store for a couple of $$.

Damn! this is so cool, buy yourself a Catalina 36, join the C36IA and get an education that others pay $thousands$ for.

I bought some extra leads from DX.com and replaced the ends with alligator clips. Great for working solo. Another useful tool is one of those thirds hands. They help hold your work while you solder it all together. Plus add in some heat shrink tube to complete the job.

Sent from my Android Tablet

[quote=William Miller;21165]A very good book to have is Nigel Calders books ,not sure of the spelling,[/quote]

Calder's book "Boatowner's Mechanical and Electrical Manual" I think is likely the one you would want.

Also Charlie Wing has a good electrical book, "Boatowner's Illustrated Electrical Handbook".

There are others but those two seem to pop up most often as good references for the DIYer.

And has been mentioned a couple of times in the last few days, the Technical Sections of the C36IA are full of content as well, also the Owner's Encyclopedia has a lot of very good reference info in it as well.

Wow, Joel, that is great news. As you correctly admitted, the knowledge and familiarity you gained is worth a lot.

BTW, that photo link only works for you, I suspect, and not us because we aren't logged in to your dropbox account.

Great news Joel! What you found was the 20amp engine circuit breaker that tripped either because it got wet or a component it protects got wet. As long as it does not trip again, it means that the fault was temporary and you should be good to go.

[QUOTE=JAS;21241]Thanks gents. I attached the picture a different way. Can you see it now???[/QUOTE]

Yes. Thank you.

BTW, David Power had given you the location of the 20A circuit breaker (reset) button is his earlier post in this thread.

That's a gawdaful place for a circuit breaker because just a little bit of spray from almost anything back there could be a problem. Even if it's waterproof, vibration and heat are enemies. I think later years have this in a different place. On our boat, the breaker is under the game table. Don't know if this is factory or not.....

Joel,

Thanks for this information. I have always wondered what this red button was for; on my boat it is not labeled. I have always been afraid to test it. A stupid question-if you are checking the engine while it is running, can you use this button to stop it?

Richard

I've heard that on a MKII, killing electrical power won't stop the engine because the mechanical fuel pump is below the fuel tank and siphon action might keep fuel flowing. Other than fuel delivery, a diesel typically does not need electricity to run once started.

The proper way to shut down a diesel is by the fuel shutoff. That's the pull lever on your engine control panel. There's a cable from it that connects to a lever on your engine, adjacent to your throttle cable. If the engine is running and you need to stop it without going to the cockpit, you can move this lever at the engine and it will stop the engine.

[B]A caution about working on running engines. Exercise EXTREME caution working on a running boat engine because you're not on a stationary platform.[/B]

Since I greatly admire your experience and knowledge, I hesitate to question your response. However, I'm almost certain that stopping a diesel engine by using the decompression lever, is not a good practice. On the M35A, the engine stop handle/cable attaches to an 'engine stop lever', seen on pgs. 20 and 21 of the M35 parts manual. This assembly, I believe, shuts off the fuel. If you look at part #300164, Number 4 on the parts diagram on pg 20, it is the 'idling apparatus assembly', which is part of the engine shutdown assembly and indicates to me that it is related to the fuel system. Decompression levers, as far as I'm aware, operate by slightly opening the exhaust valve. I've read in other manuals that an engine should not be stopped via the decompression lever except as a last resort as, when running at operating speeds, it can cause the exhaust valve to contact the piston, bending or breaking the valve. I was always under the impression that a compression release was used to release compression to allow the engine to turn over more easily if the battery is low, or during hand starting of engines so equipped (like the little 8HP Yanmar on my first boat). Once the engine is spinning, the decompression lever is released, allowing the engine to start. Some hand started yard machines, like a 10HP leaf shredder, have a compression release built into the start mechanism, to make it easier to pull the cord.

edit -
see pgs 23 and 26 of the M25 service manual, which describe the engine stop mechanism related to the throttle assembly.

Again, I'm not an expert, but if I'm correct, and using the decompression lever could damage the engine, I felt that I should pose the question to ensure the proper procedure is used.

Gary,

Thanks. You're right. The lever that is attached to the engine control pull handle is not a compression release, it's a fuel shut off. I've corrected my posting. As you mention, it's [B]NOT[/B] OK to stop a running engine via compression release. Compression release on our engines is really meant to help start an engine that is slow to turn over because of cold weather or low battery.

(I once tied my decompression lever "on" when I was doing a valve lash adjustment to make the engine easier to hand turn and forgot to untie it. After I buttoned everything up and I hit the starter button, I could not believe how fast then engine spun.)

So, the lever you want to find is still the one attached to the pull handle, but it really shuts off fuel. It looks almost exactly like the throttle lever, so marking it would be a good practice.

Ive got to add a thought. I just tried to start my motor, with new batteries, 14+ volts at the starter solenoid with the charger on, and it was turning slow. So what the hell? Sounds like a$1200 starter unless I can figure out a way to rebuild it quick or whatever, talk of a tractor starter from a dealer in Mass or what.
I had thought to jump my glasspack car jumper to the starter directly to test it, before removal. Stopped at brother in laws auto shop to get my jeep back from pothole repair, he gave this same advice to jump it, then said he could rebuild the Kabuta starter.
OK, now I have a plan...
Starter jump worked fine. Cleaned the negative ground to the engine, a bit scuzzy, but not terrible, made no difference. Ground wires disappear under floorboards, one goes to the control panel, the other...Oh yea, there are 2 negative grounds, one got buried as I slid new batteries in, and forgotten in the usual spaghetti around battery boxes and control panels. Found it , pulled it up, cleaned it up, and fired up that bastard. All is well, not sick to my stomach anymore.
If I had to stay on the dock past 4/1 it was $140 a week, damn this could have gotten expensive!
So what you should get out of this story, is the starter needs and is sensitive to have full power on clean terminals on both red and black sides or it will not have the Ah to turn at all or at full speed. Using one ground wire through the thin wires of the control panel gave me a ground, not enough Ah and probably some heating going on that could have been a real issue! The antifreeze spray does not promote good contacts on a starter circuit that needs every bit of per it can have

Gary, just for your knowledge going forward all the internal engine parts in the Universals are Kubota and are available from Kubota tractor dealers much cheaper than what Universal sells them for. There is also a strong aftermarket supply of parts, especially starters, you can get them rebuilt for as low as $79 from US suppliers on eBay. The cross reference information for Universal to Kubota block numbers is contained on the main website in the owner's encyclopedia.

All Universal does is take a standard Kubota long block and marinize it, chiefly that is the water cooled exhaust manifold, the raw circuit and heat exchanger. Just about everything else is pure Kubota.

Thanks Bud,
I was on the Kubata site, and looking at how close is the nearest dealer, with just over a week to launch. My thought was to stay on the dock for $140 a week, and get the part shipped, and hope I figured out the correct problem accurately. Maybe the idea is to do research in calmer moments like now!
The good news is I corrected it for $0 and good advice from friends.

Just got an email to add. This guy at Sailon is in Syosset NY. He apparently does rebuilds for my brother in law Mechanic. This seems like the "calmer time to research this stuff when more stable minds prevail...

Paul at Sailon has a Chinese knock off of the Kubota starter for $100 or so. I was leary but 3 members have put them on and as of 3 years no problem. Time will tell. Tractorsmart.com is a great source for Kubota parts [ 99.9% of our engine components and parts are Kubota ]. Call and Ronnie will answer, he knows what a 25XP is and you will have parts in a couple days that are 1/4 the cost of Universal and are THE SAME PART.