Arghh... Nothing like opening the boat to smell diesel (strong smell), then step down the ladder to "squish" onto a carpet full of diesel and open the bilge (which is normally pretty bone dry) to find about a cup of pink diesel oozing around.
I traced things aft, through the galley, under the bulkhead into the hell-hole to check our auxiliary bladder (which was fine), only to find weeping along the foot of the wood facia that covers the tank area. Removing the facia, I found thin traces of diesel drooling from under the tank - indiscriminately from one end to the other (not surprising, since it's liquid on a boat...)
[B]Theory/Hope:[/B] The last time I fueled up it was 48 degrees a few weeks ago, and I accidentally filled it full enough for a few drops to come out of the vent. Then, we only had the engine running for about 20-30 minutes at low RPM, returning home (1/4-1/3 of a gallon?) Since then, it has gotten plenty warm (low 70's) a couple of times, so I'm thinking maybe the diesel/tank pressure expanded enough to put some pressure on the seals at the top of the tank, causing one (or more) of them to ooze diesel during the hot days.
I haven't had a chance to empty the cockpit lockers yet to gain access to the inspection ports up there, but I figured I'd ask you guys what you think? It's a '96, so I'm certainly hoping that the stainless tank isn't already shot!
Thoughts? Thanks!
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
Your's is a stainless steel tank, right, not the PVC tank?
When you fueled you might have topped the fluid level off above the top of the tank. If so, a bad gasket at one of the tank openings will allow the diesel to leak out as the liquid seeks its level. Replacing a fuel tank sender or other fuel port access is an opportunity for error when it goes back together.
It's a mess. And of course, the diesel seepage will be absorbed by the aft cabin mattress if it's in place...so it has to be thrown away at the local hazmat disposal.
On my Mk II the tank is translucent PVC, and I have thought about cutting a window in the plywood cover of the tank compartment so that I could shine a flashlight in there to actually verify the fuel level. Steve Frost pointed out to me one day that no matter how bright the flashlight it wouldn't help much on a stainless steel tank. But wouldn't it be nice to have a sight gauge to know the fuel level.
Larry Brandt
S/V High Flight #2109
Pacific Northwest, PDX-based
2002 C-36 mkII SR/FK M35B
I'm a heretic when it comes to fueling. I'll admit it. :)
My fuel gauge hasn't worked since shortly after we bought our boat in 1998. I keep regular record of fuel fills and engine hours. Our M25 does better than 0.5 gallons per hour. My spreadsheet forecasts the new amount of fuel to be expected based on run hours, too. I don't fill up the vent anymore.
So, every 20 hours I put 10 gallons back in.
Stu Jackson, C34IA Secretary, C34 #224, 1986, SR/FK, M25 engine, Rocna 10 (22#)
Hopefully you have a stainless or poly tank. We had also seen traces of diesel weeping under that wood panel and found nothing at the fittings or hoses that appeared suspect so drained and removed the tank for a complete inspection. The attached picture shows what we found on the bottom of the tank, caught it just in time. Tank material was 5052 Aluminum.
Gary Smith
93 MK I, Hull #1231
Std rig; wing keel
M35A Oberdorfer conversion
Yep, the tank is stainless.
I just too everything out and opened up the inspection ports. Supply nozzle/valve was dry. The fuel gauge sender was dry. But, then I wanted to check the return fittings, but there's no inspection port!?!? Plus, it's out of reach from the next nearest port (can barely touch the hint of weld with one finger...) Do you guys not have an inspection port over your fuel return, either? (See pic...) So, took a piece of "diaper" on the end of a coat hanger to "swab" around and it came back a little moist, but not pink, soo....???
Larry - yeah, I was hoping that would be the case with an overfill, but my wife just reminded me that we actually ran about 90 minutes since that fill up. [B]How much does diesel expand in heat?[/B]
Oddly, the cushions were barely affected, as the fuel flow followed the wall under the wood panel, then along that rail before seeping beneath the bulkhead into the galley. There's about a 1"x4" area where one cover was saturated, but the foam didn't seem to absorb the fuel (the carpet in the galley, however, has already been thrown in the hazmat dumpster).
Grrrr... First it was sewage in the bilge at Christmas. Now diesel... (Reminds me of an icebox encounter during a Chicago-Mackinac race where a busted container of potato salad in the ice box found it's way in the bilge...)
Still searching in Seattle... ;^>
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
[QUOTE=Gsmith;12938]Hopefully you have a stainless or poly tank. The attached picture shows what we found on the bottom of the tank, caught it just in time. Tank material was 5052 Aluminum.[/QUOTE]
Yikes, Gary! Good timing! Yes, our is stainless. After further review - I do think that it's the tank fitting for the fuel return, but I can't get to it without pulling the tank or cutting a new inspection port.
Blergg... All I want to do is sail, dang it! ;^>
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
Good to hear the tank is stainless that gives you a good chance it's a fitting or hose clamp. On my 93 the refrig condenser sits over the return fitting in the lazarette and wouldn't allow access for a inspection port, hopefully the Mk2 will. Good luck
Gary Smith
93 MK I, Hull #1231
Std rig; wing keel
M35A Oberdorfer conversion
Well, it only took about five hours, but I figured it out!
After cleaning everything out and waiting a day for any more drips - nothing happened (which was good news, but also confusing...) So, I started her up and let her run for a while and waited - sure enough about 15-20 drops coming down the forward end of the tank, following the line out to the aft cabin, etc...
It was a tiny crack in the return line where it made a 80 degree bend to get over the top of the tank. I'll replace that once I figure out how to do so without having to remove the whole tank to get to the return fitting on the top of the tank...
[B]
Why so much diesel all at once in the bilge/cabin/hell hole?[/B] Simply put, I think that we've been "storing" all of the leaked fuel under the tank all along. Yet, will all of the gear on the port side of the boat (genset, watermaker, etc...) she always leans a little to port at dock, having the fuel gather along the outboard wall beneath the tank all along.
We just removed a TON of gear from the boat last week (and emptied the holding tank) - about 400lbs, mostly from port of center. So, now she actually leans to starboard a little bit!
Sure, sailing on an a port tack would have had us "over", but not for long enough to all ooze out - it would just start to saturate the facia/panel seal before we'd tack and it'd end up oozing the other way again, etc... This, or, the leak just started and is that much worse at higher RPM, etc...
Either way - much relieved that the tank is fine! Though, I'm going to leave the panel out for awhile after the repair with absorbent mats everywhere, just to double check and diagnose!!!
Crossing fingers...
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Steve Ramsey - Puget Sound
S/V Manonash - '96 C36 mkII (#1586) - M35B
The other week we discovered that the usual cocktail blend of seawater and rainwater that accumulates in the bilge is now flavored with a hint of diesel fuel.
The source of the contamination (ascertained after checking a number of other possible leak sources) is the gasket at the fuel sender, which -- with a full tank -- is weeping fuel when we're heeled over to starboard on our Mark I.
Anyone have suggestions on sourcing a replacement gasket (without buying a new sender unit)? Or can I just make one myself out of suitable gasket material from an auto-parts store?
Matthew Chachère
s/v ¡Que Chévere!
(Formerly 1985 C36 MKI #466 tall rig fin keel M25)
2006 Catalina Morgan 440 #30.
Homeported in eastern Long Island, NY
Answering my own query: The 5-bolt sender gasket seems to be pretty standard, available at WM and Amazon. I just purchased on E-bay for 7 bucks (not boat bucks, for a change!) , including shipping.
Matthew Chachère
s/v ¡Que Chévere!
(Formerly 1985 C36 MKI #466 tall rig fin keel M25)
2006 Catalina Morgan 440 #30.
Homeported in eastern Long Island, NY