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May
2003 Technical
Notes
by Bob McCullough
2199 Old Skippack Road - Woxall, PA 18979 - (215)
234-4491
E-mail: rmccullough@comcast.net
And
Tom Senator
12 Vreeland Place – Allendale, NJ 07401 – (201)
818-0544
E-mail: tsenator@cisco.com
Starting with this issue Tom Senator will be writing
part of this column mostly concerning the Mark II 36s whereas I will be
dealing with the earlier boats. We will collaborate on both when needed.
We would like to have all those owners who have
experienced a failing or failed stemhead fitting to contact Dennis Stovall
at dstovall@gci.net.
Give Dennis the information on how the fitting failed. Please do this as
soon as possible. We want to do everything possible to help you.
Note to Wolfgang Postler:
I have answered all your posts but they have all been
non-deliverable for some reason. Please check your e-mail address and send
it to me to check against the one I have.
84 C36 Tach
Hi Bob:
The
tech notes I got from you a few months ago have been invaluable - thanks.
I just made the wiring harness upgrade to my C36 #206 yesterday. As
predicted, it took me about 4-5 hours to complete but I sure do feel
better. My plugs were corroded and there was evidence of overheating. I
also replaced the wire from the alternator to the starter with a #6 wire
with lugs - thanks for the pointer. I can’t wait to see the benefits.
The glow plug solenoid upgrade is next.
My question. My tach does not
seem to resemble anything mentioned in the tech. notes. It does not have
any visible manufacturer markings, but it is a tach only (no hour meter).
It goes from 0-4000 RPM and on the back it has a switch labeled A, B &
C - this is a recessed switch designed to be changed by a slot-type
screwdriver. It also has a much smaller recessed slot-screw that is
labeled CAL. It has a one-wire feed (blue) from the back of the alternator
and a power and ground along with a light. I can touch about 3900 RPM on
this thing which makes me think it is not reading correctly. My panel has
the following: the tach, temp, voltmeter (replaced ammeter), separate hour
meter, blower toggle switch, glow plug toggle switch, an ignition
key-switch and the engine stop pull cable. Any suggestions on how to
calibrate this type of tach??
Are you still happy with your
anchor roller you installed on your boat?? I'm about to do the same and
install a Lofrans windlass. Any suggestions? Thanks for all your help.
Russ Williams, FOUR SAIL, Cruiser@WT.net
Russ:
You
have a Teleflex Tach. The A, B, and C positions are used to calibrate the
tach according to the number of poles in the alternator and the pulley
ratios. The CAL screw is for the final setting. You determine the pulley
ratio by actually turning the engine over by hand and counting the turns
each pulley makes. Or do it the easy way, divide the crankshaft pulley
diameter by the alternator pulley diameter.
Start
by putting a small strip of tape on the larger pulley (the engine
crankshaft) and one on the alternator pulley. Release the engine
compression lever so you can turn the engine over by hand. As you make 1
turn on the engine count the turns on the alternator pulley. This is the
pulley ratio.
Now,
depending on the number of poles in the alternator you select one of the
settings, A, B, or C. Once this is done the CAL screw is used for the
final setting. Using a fluorescent droplight, use Chusk Husick's method of
checking the engine RPMs. It's in the tech notes. Adjust the tach with the
CAL screw. That's it. If you give me the pulley ratio I can give you the
switch setting. When you use the CAL screw be very careful. Small
increments only or you can damage the internal mechanism. Engine speed
should be 1/2 to 2/3 of maximum RPM.
It
helps if you can borrow a remote tach and have someone help you. Your tach
is probably set on the correct setting and only needs to be calibrated
with the CAL screw. Get back to me on this…Bob
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* * * *
Catalina Question
Hi Bob,
Just
sent my check to the Salzbergs to join the association and sent you a
check for the complete set of Tech Notes. Both go out in today's mail so
you should receive it soon.
I
recently had hull number 1625 surveyed and am currently signing all of the
paperwork to buy her. Two things were noted on the survey that I may need
help with.
First,
the bilge pump pops it's circuit breaker when in the automatic mode. What
trouble shooting steps should I take to determine what is causing this to
happen? How do I identify if it is bad wiring, a bad circuit breaker or a
bad bilge pump?
Second,
the surveyor put a meter on the outlets of the inverter (powered from the
battery) and said it was not grounded. We then looked at the inverter (I
was present for the survey) and the ground wire was connected. The
surveyor then used a multi-meter to test output from each of the
receptacles in the outlet. If he put one probe in the positive receptacle
and one in the negative receptacle he got 120v. If he put one probe in the
positive receptacle and one in the ground receptacle, he got about 66v. If
he put one in the negative receptacle and one in the ground receptacle, he
got about 65v. I believe the surveyor said that there should be 120v when
he connected two of the receptacles (don't remember which two) and nothing
when he connected the other two. The outlets connected to shore power work
as advertised. Any ideas here? This
one may be confusing; any help would be appreciated.
I
have read most of the past notes on the web and look forward to getting
aboard my boat this Friday and comparing things to the tech notes. Thanks,
you really do provide a valuable service.
Scott Shaw, SShaw@ida.org
Scott:
Your
copy of the Tech Notes was mailed a couple of days ago.
I
take it that the panel has provision for the bilge pump. If not, then it
should be on a separate little panel of its own and fused instead of a
breaker. If it only pops on auto mode then the float switch could be bad
but I doubt that. Is it OK on manual mode when you hold the switch on or
does it pop then? I would trace the wires out and see if there is a break
or worn wires that are rubbing together. Then I would temporarily connect
to a larger rated breaker and see if that one pops. If it does, then your
pump is most likely at fault. I mean only about 5 amps larger.
There
should be only 120 VAC when you connect to the positive and negative
slots. There should be no voltage between the ground and neutral or
between negative and ground. Your inverter is either wired incorrectly or
it is defective. Get an electronics man to look at it and see what the
trouble is…Bob
Thanks Bob. I look forward to getting the tech notes.
Hopefully the postman will not be deterred by the snow!
I plan to go to the boat this
weekend and do some general cleaning and look at the bilge pump problem in
more detail Will let you know. The inverter can wait awhile, it won't be
used for a few months now. I appreciate the help!
Scott
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Fuel Gauge
Bob:
To start with when I bought our boat approximately 3 years ago the
fuel gauge was inoperable. Being in the automotive repair business all my
life I knew just how to check it out. Started by checking the gauge. It
had power but when you ground the negative side of the gauge it would not
move so I replaced the gauge. Still inoperable but the needle would move
when grounding the negative side so I went to the sender unit and replaced
it with an aftermarket/universal sender which I had to adjust to fit the
tank. Seemed ok, filled tank went to full, great now I knew how much fuel
I had, I thought. I was sure happy about the great fuel consumption I was
getting until Sunday when it ran out & I had to sail into our slip.
Now comes the problem, I had to carry 5 gallons of fuel to the
boat, since my marina does not have diesel. Now I can't get the system to
bleed out. I know the electric fuel pump is working ok because it just
goes tick, tick, tick instead of tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiick real fast. Any
suggestions?
Cecil Griggs, cecil@importcarcenter.com,
Ultimate Cruz, Hull# 468
Cecil:
You
can't use any other sender unit. I am sending you the fuel sender test
procedure. Follow it and you will find out if you are OK. I'm not sure if
the test procedure will work on any other sender than the proper one. If
you have to order a new sender get the one made for the Catalina. It is a
Stewart Warner sender and has a specific ohms rating. You will have to get
a new sender unless you have the old one to reinstall.
The
fuel pump will only go fast on first turning the key. Once it loads up
then it goes very slowly until you start the engine. Try bleeding the
system at the fuel filter on the engine. If you get fuel there go to the
injector pump and bleed that. Once you have fuel at the pump then go to
the fuel pipes at the injectors and bleed them too. You should be OK if
you get fuel at all those places…Bob
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Fuel Leak
Dear Bob:
I have hull 884, a 1988 standard rig. I replaced the fuel tank last
fall. Catalina was very helpful and priced it right. The old one had
several pinhole leaks in the bottom.
Now, however, when I fill the tank I get fuel in the bilge for
several days. Not a lot, but enough so the water has a slight sheen and
the diesel odor. I don't think it is coming from the filler pipe or the
vent hose, although that is about all I know to check. The tank is not
leaking. The filling of the tank has occurred without starting the engine,
so I don't think any fuel lines to or from the motor are the cause. Have
you heard of this before?
Some other points, when I bought the boat in 98, I built my own
perch seats from polymer plastic purchased from Tap Plastics, they are
bolted and sit on the lower stern pulpit rail, swing around behind the
split backstays and supported by 2 upright pieces of rail, mounted stereo
speakers underneath. I did not want to have to install and remove them
every time I used the boat, so I made them permanent, and with Sunbrella
blue snap on cushions to match the dodger and bimini. At Sail Expo, I
ordered rail cushions cut to finish the installation.
I did something similar on the C 30 I had, I bought from the
factory C 270 stern pulpits and installed them, looked great, but got
complex, due to lifeline lengths, different levels of the mounts etc, and
expensive, $800 in 1997.
Back to the 36, I also lowered the stove assembly, and cut a board
to fit the stove top, covered it with matching laminate, and teak fiddle,
so I have more counter top space. Cut white laminate to fit the bulkhead
above the fridge, that really brightened up the galley. Installed a new
engine panel on the cockpit backrest, made a breather hose mount for the
engine air filter to keep the fumes burning instead of into the bilge,
installed a 15 X 10 fixed 3 blade for the Sacramento delta motoring needs.
The Delta requires a bimini, so I had a huge one made that extends
from the dodger to about 2 feet behind the backstays, I also had a UV
screen window placed in it, so I could see the mainsail from a standing
position at the helm, and a cover for that window to keep out the sun at
the dock. Sitting on the stern perch seats, you are still shaded from the
overhead sun, it is hot out here. More stuff done, but I'll close now. One
day I'll send digital photos to you for Mainsheet. David Atherton ctlna@msn.com
David:
No, this is a new one on me. The diesel has to be coming from
somewhere. Most likely it does come from the vent hose as that is a long
run. It could have a pinhole in it somewhere along the line. Do this. Get
some hose that fits the vent pipe on the tank and run it up through the
cabin to the outside the next time you fill the tank. Have the hose long
enough to stick overside while filling the tank. See if you still get
diesel in the bilge when you fill. If not, there is your answer. You will
have to replace the vent hose all the way or vent it at the side of the
hull.
There is another way to check the vent hose. Take it off the tank
and off the fitting at the stern. Plug it on one end and inject some air.
If it won't hold pressure there is your leak.
Do send me pictures and a write-up on your mods, please. They sound
good enough for the Tech Notes…Bob
Thanks Bob, I'll try the extra
hose idea first.
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* * * *
Fuel Tank Pressure
Hi Bob:
I was wondering if you could help me out. I've got a 1987 -
Catalina 36 which we sail regularly on SF Bay. Last weekend I was trying
to fill my fuel tank but couldn't get more than a few gallons in before
the tank seemed to pressurize and the fuel started flowing out of the
overflow line in the transom. I checked for some type of pressure relief
valve on the tank but none appeared obvious. I had been out the previous
day in very windy (30-35kts) and wavy conditions. My thinking is that I
shook up the fuel enough to create some pressure. Now I can't seem to get
rid of it. Any thoughts/ideas you might have would be great. Thanks a
million.
Doug Petty PettyD@bsci.com,
Mein Boat
PS-the engine runs fine and there is still ~1/4 tank of fuel.
Doug:
There is no pressure relief valve on the tank or anywhere else. Are
you sure that you needed fuel. What I'm asking is your tank sender
working? You have the same year as Felicity II and the M-25 21HP engine.
That's pretty economical on fuel like 1/2 gal per hour at cruising
throttle.
Diesel usually does not evaporate like gas and doesn't produce
vapor pressure or lock. I really can't tell you much but you might try
removing the return line from the engine to the tank and see if the
relieves any pressure. The same thing can be done with the overflow hose
at the tank.
Since the overflow did work the hose must be clear so that isn't
the problem. I can't suggest anything else except that your tank had more
fuel in it than you thought. I can send you the procedure to check the
tank sender as an attachment to this note…Bob
Bob:
Thanks
for the quick response I thought about the sender and as you say the
engine is very fuel efficient, however, I've been watching the gauge and
also "sounded" the tank to get a rough sense of how full it was.
I haven't put any fuel in since late last year as we don't motor much (in
and/out of slip). We get plenty of wind here in San Francisco!! Do you
know if is there an anti-siphon valve on the fill line that would prevent
venting during filling? Thanks for the attachment. I'll let you know how
it turns out! Doug
Doug:
Nope,
ain’t no anti-siphon valve in the line…Bob
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* * * *
M35
Universal Cam Sleeve Missing
Tom:
How do I know if the camshaft and/or pump
have been damaged? What is the failure mode? I am concerned that I will
experience premature camshaft or pump failure because this engine did not
have the Cam Sleeve on. Travis C36MKII #1811
Travis:
Hi,
first lets make the assumption that you've removed the water pump and can
examine the "tangs" on the camshaft from the hole where the
water pump was. Its not too hard and the instructions are here. http://www.catalina36.org/Article_servicebull235.htm.
Its fairly easy, only a few bolts. Your boat is only 11 after mine (I have
hull # 1800) so it’s a pretty good chance that the sleeve is missing.
You
would know very quickly if the tangs broke because it would then fail to
turn your water pump and you engine would overheat quickly. But just look
in and you should see 2 tangs sticking out of the camshaft. If they are
both there and you don't see any cracks at the base of the tangs, then you
should be OK and you should be able to "carefully" press the
reinforcing sleeve in place and all should be well. I am also assuming
that you have already contacted Westerbeke or the distributor about the
missing sleeve and have one to put on. If not contact them directly
and they will get one out to right away. Be sure to include all the
pertinent information, so that this is documented with them. The
Westerbeke service bulletin # is #235.
I
understand your concerns about premature camshaft or pump failure. As far
as the pump is concerned, its my thought that, unless you severely
overheated or its leaking then I think you are ok. As for the camshaft,
that is tricky to say and I don't have a direct answer. You are most
likely ok if you there are no chips, chunks or cracks visible on the
tangs. And if you can get the sleeve on without any incident, then I think
you'll be fine. (One person had a problem putting on the sleeve and broke
one tang. I cannot be sure he bent the sleeve going on or their was a
previous defect). Remember to be very careful pushing the sleeve on, the
camshaft is extremely hardened metal (it has to be) and that can make it
more brittle.
Really
the only way to be 100% sure is to remove the camshaft, bring it to a
machine shop and have it "dye tested" for any cracks. But if I
was going that far, I guess I would just get a new camshaft put in. I
wouldn't worry about it, BUT I would write a letter to Westerbeke
documenting your concerns, so that if something does happen in the future,
then you have something to point to.
Really,
the Kubota engine block that Westerbeke uses is a great engine block with
many, many years of service in marine and tractor engines. It should serve
you long and well…Tom
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Transmission
Shift linkage adjustment (Cont’d)
Tom:
The
recent postings made me realize I may need to adjust the transmission
linkage - when shifting into forward there is a definite pause (almost 2-3
seconds) before engaging. When at the engine I can give the lever an extra
downward push and it clicks immediately into forward.
If
I push the shift lever hard and fast at the helm it also engages into
forward faster than if I push the shift lever forward slowly (so maybe
that is the short term fix). There is no similar problem shifting into
reverse (and the fact the shift lever hits the instrument pod bracket tube
going into forward shows the design flaw -- a longer pin to bring the
shift lever outboard might fix this)
In
any event, after looking at the linkage at the engine, I cannot figure out
how to adjust the cable length. There is what appears to be an adjustment
nut on the threaded rod, and I have adjusted that but I cannot figure out
how to "shorten" the cable.
Thanks
for the help. Bill Harvey, About Time #1457
Bill:
This
has been addressed a few times before. First make sure it’s not
something else with your transmission and is in fact the linkage cable out
of spec (which it seems you have done). There is a Catalina tech note on
just this adjustment (You can read the details here http://www.catalina36.org/Article_transmission.htm
) Its ENGINEERING BULLETIN No. 57 from Catalina on 5/7/02 which covers
this. But more than a few have come to the conclusion that you have, no
level of adjustment is going to get the desired throw within the specs and
within the right geometry directly above the transmission throw arm.
What
I think happens is that over time or other reasons, that the cable from
the Edson pedestal to the transmission gets stretched and gets out of
spec. (I think the design is on the edge anyway but that is another story)
The quick and easy fix by a few of us is to just cut the end of the
threaded cable by a little bit...maybe 3/8".
Adjusting
the linkage correctly for the C36 can definitely be a challenge
(especially in cases such as yours). If it is not done correctly or spot
on it can be an annoyance at best (such as yours) or dangerous and
damaging at worst. It is theoretically possible that a poorly adjusted
linkage can damage your Hurth Transmission (Been there ...done that).
Make
sure with the adjustment that you get the full 30 mm or 35 mm throw (from
Center-line as measured from bottom or top hole on lever arm). As you have
found, it is difficult to adjust correctly without shift lever hitting
somewhere on the pedestal (Been there..... done that, too) Do not accept
just "ok". If it doesn't meet the spec without hitting somewhere
on the pedestal, then it is not right.
Now
we arrive at where you are at. It would be MUCH BETTER if the design was
such that the adjusting nut that hinges into the Hurth Transmission lever
was threaded ALL THE WAY THROUGH. As you know it is "closed
ended" and as such you cannot adjust the lever to where it belongs.
There have been 2 things done by C36 owners that have accomplished the
lever and throw to be where it needs to be.
1)
Cut approx 3/8 of an inch off the end of the threads on the cable down
where the lever is on the transmission. (If you are only a little off,
this might get you much closer to where it should be)
2)
If all else fails, do what I did (I do not recommend this for everyone,
but I just drilled a hole lower on the Hurth lever arm to get the full
throw required)
3)
Possibly, but never tried by anyone I know of, is to replace your cable if
it is truly stretched, with a new one that is a higher quality and meets
tighter specs. Edson has info in their Catalog on the different types of
Teleflex cable for this application.
But
personally I think the EASIEST design change by Westerbeke/Edson would be
to change that threaded adjusting nut with ball (on the Hurth
Transmission) to threaded all the way through. All it would take is to
drill thru and tap some threads. This would be the ultimate retrofit for
this issue and allow much more range of adjustment. Stay tuned because I
think I might try this modification this summer. I will take pictures and
post what I find. Good luck…Tom
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Reverse
Polarity Light
Tom:
The
green shore power light on the electrical panel goes on/off intermittently
when the switch is on. This has been occurring for the last several months
but I have not experienced any problems with the 16,500 BTU A/C, microwave
or any other electrical appliance. Over the last two weeks the reverse
polarity light has also been going on/off intermittently as well. Even
with these lights going off/on, I have not experienced any performance
issues with the A/C, etc. I am curious if this is a common problem with
the indicator lights and if I should look for any possible problems (or
change the lights). I have had two very experienced marine repair
technicians tell me it is not a problem but I still wanted to check with
you. I have previously used this service from the C36 web site with good
results. Thanks
Gary
Lorio 1996 C36 #1572
Gary:
I
do not know this to be that common of a problem on our boats. Though I
have had the Red LED go out that was the indicator for my Propane Solenoid
and had to replace it. I think I recall that it was acting a little flaky
and intermittent before it went, so these might be ready to go.
The
Green Shore power LED is wired directly across the Black (Hot) and White
(Neutral) of your 115VAC leads on your Nav Table AC power switch. It’s
pretty simple. If it doesn't light, then you either have a) a bad LED
connection, b) a bad LED or c) No Power coming from source (which you
believe to be ok).
The
reverse polarity LED has one side attached to the White (Neutral) and the
other lead attached to the Green (Ground) of your 115VAC power. For all
practical purposes the reverse polarity light should never go on. If you
see it becoming a bright Red then I might be a bit concerned. Under what
conditions does the reverse polarity light come on? Does it come on
bright? It’s normal to see a very dim red glow once in a while and
mostly when there is a high 115VAC load coming into the boat. There should
be no real current flow to your Green (Ground) on your boat back to the
dock. This can be dangerous, if indeed you have a short or incorrectly
wired boat.
Do
you have the reverse polarity test button on your boat? I have it on mine.
(I have 1999 C36MKII Hull #1800) You can test your reverse polarity light
with it. The button is a momentary button just to make sure that the light
works. Maybe I would try that test button when it looks like the reverse
polarity starts going on/off intermittently. If it doesn't light, then you
either have a bad LED connection or a bad LED (or in the extreme case a
bad switch), but I'm make the assumption that this button works most of
the time.
But
listening to your symptoms, sounds like you have a few flaky LED's or LED
connections. These LED's are pretty cheap and you might want to replace
one to see if the problem goes away…Tom
(Note: LEDs
are polarity-sensitive so be sure that you have the leads correctly
wired…Bob)
*
* * * *
GPS INTERFERENCE ALERT
Ever
have the GPS sporadically lose position or get wildly erratic readings
without knowing why? Do you have your TV with TV antenna on? It might have
something to do with it.
It
has come to the attention of the U.S. Coast Guard and Federal
Communications Commission that certain consumer electronics-grade active
VHF/UHF marine television antennas are causing operational degradation in
the performance of Global Positioning System (GPS) receivers. This
interference may be realized as a display of inaccurate position
information or a complete loss of GPS receiver acquisition and tracking
ability.
If
you are experiencing recurring outages or degradation of your GPS receiver
operation you should perform an on-off test of your TV antenna. If turning
off the power to the antenna results in improvement in the GPS receiver
performance, the antenna may be the source of interference in the GPS
band. In that case, you should contact the manufacturer of the antenna and
identify the symptoms. Some antennae models have been identified
during investigations for GPS interference. This is not inclusive and all
active TV antennas could be suspect. For details go to the link here
http://www.uscg.mil/hq/g-m/moa/docs/11-02.htm
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